E3 wise, on 17 November 2013 - 09:47 AM, said:
I am discussing the water used to produce the fossil fuels used to heat the water. .
How is water used to produce fossil fuels?
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13
Please post your water saving tips here.
Started by Shortpoet-GTD, Jul 10 2012 06:07 AM
70 replies to this topic
#42
Posted 17 November 2013 - 10:14 AM
Oil -water is mixed with mud to provide a slurry in drilling, also in the production of well casing and finally the largest share is actually used in the refining process. During the separation distilling of hydrocarbons water is added in refining stacks.
Natural gas water is used in same ways plus now fracking which is using millions of gallons to break up the rocks.
Coal- water is used to spray over the coal to lessen explosion risks and keep dust down, coal slurry must be diluted using even more water due to its pollution hazard and has to be further processed. In the breaking down of large coal rocks to smaller transportable size water is used.
I could go on and on, but that is how water is used in fossil fuel production.
Natural gas water is used in same ways plus now fracking which is using millions of gallons to break up the rocks.
Coal- water is used to spray over the coal to lessen explosion risks and keep dust down, coal slurry must be diluted using even more water due to its pollution hazard and has to be further processed. In the breaking down of large coal rocks to smaller transportable size water is used.
I could go on and on, but that is how water is used in fossil fuel production.
#44
Posted 17 November 2013 - 10:39 AM
see that's where we are not communicating in steam production water is used but not consumed in fossil fuel production it is consumed and separated from the hydrological cycle. also what good is water that is used but highly polluted, steam does not pollute the water but fossil fuel production does, which is why fracking water must be recovered, as much as possible and stored in special repositories to prevent it from releasing all the benzene and other chemicals into water systems. If the water is so polluted it can not be reused, I would say that is consumed, all fossil fuels do this.
#45
Posted 17 November 2013 - 10:55 AM
E3 wise, on 17 November 2013 - 10:39 AM, said:
I would say that is consumed, all fossil fuels do this.
Excuse my ignorance for not understanding why this series of processes consumes water.
#46
Posted 17 November 2013 - 01:30 PM
Please refer to the following links if you do not understand the issue. I would also like to point out that when you draw thousands of gallons of water a day from underground aquifers, that has taken thousands of years to form, it just does not magically reappear because it is now in the atmosphere. Meaning drought areas are trading drinking water for electrical generation and those aquifers are not being recharged,
Power generation has been estimated to be second only to agriculture in being the largest domestic user of water.[1] To produce and burn the 1 billion tons of coal America uses each year, the mining and utility industries withdraw 55 trillion to 75 trillion gallons of water annually, according to the US Geological Survey.[2]
It was estimated in January 2011 report by the Civil Society Institute, "Benefits of Beyond BAU: Human, Social, and Environmental Damages Avoided through the Retirement of the US Coal Fleet", that the number of gallons drawn per day for nuclear and coal power plants is 200 billion gallons. According to data collected by the United States Geological Survey (USGS), water withdrawals from thermoelectric power sources account for 49 percent of total withdrawals in the United States in 2005, or 201 billions a day.[3]
The 2012 report "Burning Our Rivers: The Water Footprint of Electricity" estimates that a mega-watt hour (MWh) of electricity generated by coal withdraws approximately 16,052 gallons and consumes approximately 692 gallons of water.[4]
Additionally, the debris from mountaintop removal is often pushed into streams, depleting freshwater supplies. Coal combustion produces the nation’s largest share of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases that are accelerating global climate change and also diminishing the nation’s freshwater reserves. And water is used daily in mining operations to cool and lubricate mining machinery, wash haul roads and truck wheels to reign in airborne particulates, and to suppress underground coal dust that otherwise could ignite.
http://www.sourcewat...rom_coal_plants
Water Resource Use
Electricity generation generally involves the consumption of water resources (e.g., for steam production and cooling, equipment cleaning, and other purposes). The water consumption and the environmental impacts of water use vary from technology to technology, as described below.
Natural Gas
The burning of natural gas in combustion turbines requires very little water. However, natural gas-fired boiler and combined cycle systems do require water for cooling purposes. When power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, affecting animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources.
Coal
Large quantities of water are frequently needed to remove impurities from coal at the mine. In addition, coal-fired power plants use large quantities of water for producing steam and for cooling. When coal-fired power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be affected, as well as animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources.
Oil
Oil-fired power plants use large quantities of water for steam production and cooling. When oil-fired power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, which affects those animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources.
In addition, the drilling of oil requires water to remove obstructions from the well, and refineries require water in the various processes used to refine crude oil into usable fuel.
Nuclear Energy
Nuclear power plants use large quantities of water for steam production and for cooling. When nuclear power plants remove water from a lake or river for steam production and cooling, fish and other aquatic life can be affected.
Municipal Solid Waste
Power plants that burn MSW are normally smaller than fossil fuel power plants but typically require a similar amount of water per unit of electricity generated. When water is removed from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, affecting those animals and people who depend on these resources.
Hydroelectricity
Hydropower often requires the use of dams, which can greatly affect the flow of rivers, altering ecosystems and affecting the wildlife and people who depend on those waters.
Often, water at the bottom of the lake created by a dam is inhospitable to fish because it is much colder and oxygen-poor compared with water at the top. When this colder, oxygen-poor water is released into the river, it can kill fish living downstream that are accustomed to warmer, oxygen-rich water.
In addition, some dams withhold water and then release it all at once, causing the river downstream to suddenly flood. This action can disrupt plant and wildlife habitats and affect drinking water supplies.
Non-Hydroelectric Renewable Energy
Solar
Photovoltaic systems do not require the use of any water to create electricity. Solar-thermal technologies may tap local water resources if the liquid that is being heated to create steam is water. In this case, the water can be re-used after it has been condensed from steam back into water.
Geothermal
Geothermal power plants usually re-inject the hot water that they remove from the ground back into wells. However, a small amount of water used by geothermal plants in the process of creating electricity may evaporate and therefore not be returned to the ground. Also, for those geothermal plants that rely on hot, dry rocks for energy, water from local resources is needed to extract the energy from the dry rocks.
Biomass
Biomass power plants require the use of water, because the boilers burning the biomass need water for steam production and for cooling. If this water is used over and over again, the amount of water needed is reduced. Whenever any type of power plant removes water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, which then affects those animals and people that depend on these aquatic resources.
Landfill Gas
Engines or combustion turbines that burn landfill gas to produce energy typically require negligible amounts of water.
Wind
Wind turbines in areas with little rainfall may require the use of a small amount of water. If rainfall is not sufficient to keep the turbine blades clean, water is used to clean dirt and insects off the blades so that turbine performance is not reduced.
http://www.epa.gov/c...r-resource.html
When coal is kept in the ground, it helps keep our water safe and clean; when it is mined and burned, toxins accumulated from millions of years of filtration are released into the environment.
http://waterdefense.org/content/coal
During 2005, an estimated 4,020 million gallons per day (Mgal/d) was withdrawn for mining purposes. (All 2005 water use information is from the report Estimated use of water in the United States in 2005.) Mining withdrawals were about 1 percent of total withdrawals and about 2 percent of total withdrawals for all categories excluding thermoelectric power. Groundwater was the source for 63 percent of total withdrawals for mining. Sixty percent of the groundwater withdrawals for mining were saline. Most of the surface-water withdrawals (87 percent) were freshwater. Saline groundwater withdrawals and fresh surface-water withdrawals together represented 70 percent of the total withdrawals for mining.
http://ga.water.usgs.gov/edu/wumi.html
AS I have said I can go on and on, but here is my real question. Are you a moderator for an alternative energy and environmental website actually advocating using coal? The dirtiest most polluting form of energy generation known to man< and denying its effect on water resources?
Because if you are it is time for us to move on and stop supporting this forum!!!!
I am hoping I am just misunderstanding you.
Power generation has been estimated to be second only to agriculture in being the largest domestic user of water.[1] To produce and burn the 1 billion tons of coal America uses each year, the mining and utility industries withdraw 55 trillion to 75 trillion gallons of water annually, according to the US Geological Survey.[2]
It was estimated in January 2011 report by the Civil Society Institute, "Benefits of Beyond BAU: Human, Social, and Environmental Damages Avoided through the Retirement of the US Coal Fleet", that the number of gallons drawn per day for nuclear and coal power plants is 200 billion gallons. According to data collected by the United States Geological Survey (USGS), water withdrawals from thermoelectric power sources account for 49 percent of total withdrawals in the United States in 2005, or 201 billions a day.[3]
The 2012 report "Burning Our Rivers: The Water Footprint of Electricity" estimates that a mega-watt hour (MWh) of electricity generated by coal withdraws approximately 16,052 gallons and consumes approximately 692 gallons of water.[4]
Additionally, the debris from mountaintop removal is often pushed into streams, depleting freshwater supplies. Coal combustion produces the nation’s largest share of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases that are accelerating global climate change and also diminishing the nation’s freshwater reserves. And water is used daily in mining operations to cool and lubricate mining machinery, wash haul roads and truck wheels to reign in airborne particulates, and to suppress underground coal dust that otherwise could ignite.
http://www.sourcewat...rom_coal_plants
Water Resource Use
Electricity generation generally involves the consumption of water resources (e.g., for steam production and cooling, equipment cleaning, and other purposes). The water consumption and the environmental impacts of water use vary from technology to technology, as described below.
Natural Gas
The burning of natural gas in combustion turbines requires very little water. However, natural gas-fired boiler and combined cycle systems do require water for cooling purposes. When power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, affecting animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources.
Coal
Large quantities of water are frequently needed to remove impurities from coal at the mine. In addition, coal-fired power plants use large quantities of water for producing steam and for cooling. When coal-fired power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be affected, as well as animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources.
Oil
Oil-fired power plants use large quantities of water for steam production and cooling. When oil-fired power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, which affects those animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources.
In addition, the drilling of oil requires water to remove obstructions from the well, and refineries require water in the various processes used to refine crude oil into usable fuel.
Nuclear Energy
Nuclear power plants use large quantities of water for steam production and for cooling. When nuclear power plants remove water from a lake or river for steam production and cooling, fish and other aquatic life can be affected.
Municipal Solid Waste
Power plants that burn MSW are normally smaller than fossil fuel power plants but typically require a similar amount of water per unit of electricity generated. When water is removed from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, affecting those animals and people who depend on these resources.
Hydroelectricity
Hydropower often requires the use of dams, which can greatly affect the flow of rivers, altering ecosystems and affecting the wildlife and people who depend on those waters.
Often, water at the bottom of the lake created by a dam is inhospitable to fish because it is much colder and oxygen-poor compared with water at the top. When this colder, oxygen-poor water is released into the river, it can kill fish living downstream that are accustomed to warmer, oxygen-rich water.
In addition, some dams withhold water and then release it all at once, causing the river downstream to suddenly flood. This action can disrupt plant and wildlife habitats and affect drinking water supplies.
Non-Hydroelectric Renewable Energy
Solar
Photovoltaic systems do not require the use of any water to create electricity. Solar-thermal technologies may tap local water resources if the liquid that is being heated to create steam is water. In this case, the water can be re-used after it has been condensed from steam back into water.
Geothermal
Geothermal power plants usually re-inject the hot water that they remove from the ground back into wells. However, a small amount of water used by geothermal plants in the process of creating electricity may evaporate and therefore not be returned to the ground. Also, for those geothermal plants that rely on hot, dry rocks for energy, water from local resources is needed to extract the energy from the dry rocks.
Biomass
Biomass power plants require the use of water, because the boilers burning the biomass need water for steam production and for cooling. If this water is used over and over again, the amount of water needed is reduced. Whenever any type of power plant removes water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, which then affects those animals and people that depend on these aquatic resources.
Landfill Gas
Engines or combustion turbines that burn landfill gas to produce energy typically require negligible amounts of water.
Wind
Wind turbines in areas with little rainfall may require the use of a small amount of water. If rainfall is not sufficient to keep the turbine blades clean, water is used to clean dirt and insects off the blades so that turbine performance is not reduced.
http://www.epa.gov/c...r-resource.html
When coal is kept in the ground, it helps keep our water safe and clean; when it is mined and burned, toxins accumulated from millions of years of filtration are released into the environment.
http://waterdefense.org/content/coal
Mining withdrawals for the Nation, 2005
file:///C:/Users/LOISMO~1/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image002.jpg
Mining water use is water used for the extraction of minerals that may be in the form of solids, such as coal, iron, sand, and gravel; liquids, such as crude petroleum; and gases, such as natural gas. The category includes quarrying, milling (crushing, screening, washing, and flotation of mined materials), re-injecting extracted water for secondary oil recovery, and other operations associated with mining activities. All mining withdrawals were considered self-supplied.During 2005, an estimated 4,020 million gallons per day (Mgal/d) was withdrawn for mining purposes. (All 2005 water use information is from the report Estimated use of water in the United States in 2005.) Mining withdrawals were about 1 percent of total withdrawals and about 2 percent of total withdrawals for all categories excluding thermoelectric power. Groundwater was the source for 63 percent of total withdrawals for mining. Sixty percent of the groundwater withdrawals for mining were saline. Most of the surface-water withdrawals (87 percent) were freshwater. Saline groundwater withdrawals and fresh surface-water withdrawals together represented 70 percent of the total withdrawals for mining.
http://ga.water.usgs.gov/edu/wumi.html
AS I have said I can go on and on, but here is my real question. Are you a moderator for an alternative energy and environmental website actually advocating using coal? The dirtiest most polluting form of energy generation known to man< and denying its effect on water resources?
Because if you are it is time for us to move on and stop supporting this forum!!!!
I am hoping I am just misunderstanding you.
#49
Posted 17 November 2013 - 05:44 PM
Not quote... forum rules...
Please refer to the following links if you do not understand the issue. I would also like to point out that when you draw thousands of gallons of water a day from underground aquifers, that has taken thousands of years to form, it just does not magically reappear because it is now in the atmosphere
end quote...
Um.......
Coal fired power stations don't, as far as I know, take water from underground aquifers. Nor do they willinglyly discharge any of the water they circulate to the atmosphere.
If you know differently I'm sure will correct my misconceptions which are based on first hand practical experience in a few power stations.
Not quote... forum rules...
The 2012 report "Burning Our Rivers: The Water Footprint of Electricity" estimates that a mega-watt hour (MWh) of electricity generated by coal withdraws approximately 16,052 gallons and consumes approximately 692 gallons of waterSo about 4% even if the figures are taken at face value.
Not quote... forum rules...
Coal combustion produces the nation’s largest share of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases that are accelerating global climate change No dispute with that.
Not quote... forum rules...
And water is used daily in mining operations to cool and lubricate mining machinery, wash haul roadsWater Again, no dispute with that.
Not quote... forum rules...
Electricity generation generally involves the consumption of water resources (e.g., for steam production and cooling, equipment cleaning, and other purposes).
That I do disagree with.
Steam generation uses recycled water. As does cooling.
I thought I explained that previously. It does not consume water.Evidently my explanation was not sufficiently lucud. For that I apologise.
Not quote... forum rules...
The water consumption and the environmental impacts of water use vary from technology to technology, as described below Consumed......
Not quote... forum rules...
Natural Gas
The burning of natural gas in combustion turbines requires very little water. However, natural gas-fired boiler and combined cycle systems do require water for cooling purposes
When power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, affecting animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources
Again, my practical experience with power stations is limited. For what it's worth, care is taken to ensure that extracted river water does not harm the marine environment. The discharged water, possibly a few degrees higher, might be an enhancement but I don't know for sure so make no claims about it.
Not quoteCoal
Large quantities of water are frequently needed to remove impurities from coal at the mine.
Possibly so. The few mining facilities I've visited didn't so I'll bow to your superior experience on that.
not quote
In addition, coal-fired power plants use large quantities of water for producing steam and for cooling. They do. And it gets circulated. Not consumed.
Not quote....Oil
Oil-fired power plants use large quantities of water for steam production and cooling.
They do. And it gets circulated. Not consumed.
Not quote
Whenoil-fired power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, which affects those animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources
I suppose you could make that point about water extraction generally. For whatever prupose. Irrigation or for treatment to make it potable.
Another not quote
AS I have said I can go on and on, but here is my real question.
Are you a moderator for an alternative energy and environmental website actually advocating using coal?
End not quote
Absolutely not and I don't know where you got that notion from. I was simply trying to disabuse some about the notions of water consumption.
Not quote
I am hoping I am just misunderstanding you.
End not quote.
Evidently so.
Please refer to the following links if you do not understand the issue. I would also like to point out that when you draw thousands of gallons of water a day from underground aquifers, that has taken thousands of years to form, it just does not magically reappear because it is now in the atmosphere
end quote...
Um.......
Coal fired power stations don't, as far as I know, take water from underground aquifers. Nor do they willinglyly discharge any of the water they circulate to the atmosphere.
If you know differently I'm sure will correct my misconceptions which are based on first hand practical experience in a few power stations.
Not quote... forum rules...
The 2012 report "Burning Our Rivers: The Water Footprint of Electricity" estimates that a mega-watt hour (MWh) of electricity generated by coal withdraws approximately 16,052 gallons and consumes approximately 692 gallons of waterSo about 4% even if the figures are taken at face value.
Not quote... forum rules...
Coal combustion produces the nation’s largest share of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases that are accelerating global climate change No dispute with that.
Not quote... forum rules...
And water is used daily in mining operations to cool and lubricate mining machinery, wash haul roadsWater Again, no dispute with that.
Not quote... forum rules...
Electricity generation generally involves the consumption of water resources (e.g., for steam production and cooling, equipment cleaning, and other purposes).
That I do disagree with.
Steam generation uses recycled water. As does cooling.
I thought I explained that previously. It does not consume water.Evidently my explanation was not sufficiently lucud. For that I apologise.
Not quote... forum rules...
The water consumption and the environmental impacts of water use vary from technology to technology, as described below Consumed......
Not quote... forum rules...
Natural Gas
The burning of natural gas in combustion turbines requires very little water. However, natural gas-fired boiler and combined cycle systems do require water for cooling purposes
When power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, affecting animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources
Again, my practical experience with power stations is limited. For what it's worth, care is taken to ensure that extracted river water does not harm the marine environment. The discharged water, possibly a few degrees higher, might be an enhancement but I don't know for sure so make no claims about it.
Not quoteCoal
Large quantities of water are frequently needed to remove impurities from coal at the mine.
Possibly so. The few mining facilities I've visited didn't so I'll bow to your superior experience on that.
not quote
In addition, coal-fired power plants use large quantities of water for producing steam and for cooling. They do. And it gets circulated. Not consumed.
Not quote....Oil
Oil-fired power plants use large quantities of water for steam production and cooling.
They do. And it gets circulated. Not consumed.
Not quote
Whenoil-fired power plants remove water from a lake or river, fish and other aquatic life can be killed, which affects those animals and people who depend on these aquatic resources
I suppose you could make that point about water extraction generally. For whatever prupose. Irrigation or for treatment to make it potable.
Another not quote
AS I have said I can go on and on, but here is my real question.
Are you a moderator for an alternative energy and environmental website actually advocating using coal?
End not quote
Absolutely not and I don't know where you got that notion from. I was simply trying to disabuse some about the notions of water consumption.
Not quote
I am hoping I am just misunderstanding you.
End not quote.
Evidently so.
#50
Posted 18 November 2013 - 04:19 AM
Besoeker, you are hovering very close to being a denier (of the data) rather than being a skeptic, and arguing
about the numbers.
To say that natural gas (fracking) doesn't use much water is incorrect.
E3 Wise works in the industry and it is well known
the amount of water used for fossil fuel extraction, especially, fracking.
I understand that you love to argue but using water resources for fuel (and the production of products) is well known.
http://grist.org/new...f-water-apiece/
EPA numbers-billions of gallons of water used consumption.
http://www.sourcewat...ter_consumption
This article speaks to the water pollution of fracking (used water)
http://www.sourcewat...water_pollution
And
http://www.environme...racking-numbers
I could post more links, but if you're in denial that billions of gallons of water are being wasted for these processes,
then I don't know what else to say.
And I agree with E3 Wise, why are you a moderator on a green web site if you don't believe the data from
hundreds of sources saying the same thing?
about the numbers.
To say that natural gas (fracking) doesn't use much water is incorrect.
E3 Wise works in the industry and it is well known
the amount of water used for fossil fuel extraction, especially, fracking.
I understand that you love to argue but using water resources for fuel (and the production of products) is well known.
http://grist.org/new...f-water-apiece/
EPA numbers-billions of gallons of water used consumption.
http://www.sourcewat...ter_consumption
This article speaks to the water pollution of fracking (used water)
http://www.sourcewat...water_pollution
And
http://www.environme...racking-numbers
I could post more links, but if you're in denial that billions of gallons of water are being wasted for these processes,
then I don't know what else to say.
And I agree with E3 Wise, why are you a moderator on a green web site if you don't believe the data from
hundreds of sources saying the same thing?
#51
Posted 18 November 2013 - 11:49 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 18 November 2013 - 04:19 AM, said:
Besoeker, you are hovering very close to being a denier (of the data) rather than being a skeptic, and arguing
about the numbers.
To say that natural gas (fracking) doesn't use much water is incorrect.
about the numbers.
To say that natural gas (fracking) doesn't use much water is incorrect.
#52
Posted 18 November 2013 - 06:16 PM
Besoeker, on 18 November 2013 - 11:49 AM, said:
I made no comment about fracking.
You said-
"Natural Gas. The burning of natural gas in combustion turbines requires very little water."
Agreed, on that one point
but-
how do they get the natural gas without fracking shale to get it? Hello?
#54
Posted 18 November 2013 - 11:02 PM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 18 November 2013 - 06:16 PM, said:
What?
You said-
"Natural Gas. The burning of natural gas in combustion turbines requires very little water."
Agreed, on that one point
but-
how do they get the natural gas without fracking shale to get it? Hello?
You said-
"Natural Gas. The burning of natural gas in combustion turbines requires very little water."
Agreed, on that one point
but-
how do they get the natural gas without fracking shale to get it? Hello?
Natural gas, like oil, is another fossil fuel and has been used for a couple of thousand years.
In UK, and, I suppose elsewhere, natural gas replaced town gas a very,very long time ago. Before the Dead Sea even reported in sick.
Ever so slightly more seriously, I remember it going on stream here. Given that we lived on a farm out in the boonies without gas anyway, it didn't have much impact on my life at the time. I've since been involved with some fairly large gas compressor drives, upwards of 6,000kW, Compressing enough gas that it affects the GDP if they go wrong, Yes, very serious stuff. They say jump. We jump.
Where does that gas come from? The North Sea and tankered in from the middle east.
None of it, as far as I'm aware, is a product of fracking.
#55
Posted 19 November 2013 - 03:49 AM
Besoeker, on 18 November 2013 - 11:02 PM, said:
Without fracking of course!
Natural gas, like oil, is another fossil fuel and has been used for a couple of thousand years.
In UK, and, I suppose elsewhere, natural gas replaced town gas a very,very long time ago. Before the Dead Sea even reported in sick.
Ever so slightly more seriously, I remember it going on stream here. Given that we lived on a farm out in the boonies without gas anyway, it didn't have much impact on my life at the time. I've since been involved with some fairly large gas compressor drives, upwards of 6,000kW, Compressing enough gas that it affects the GDP if they go wrong, Yes, very serious stuff. They say jump. We jump.
Where does that gas come from? The North Sea and tankered in from the middle east.
None of it, as far as I'm aware, is a product of fracking.
Natural gas, like oil, is another fossil fuel and has been used for a couple of thousand years.
In UK, and, I suppose elsewhere, natural gas replaced town gas a very,very long time ago. Before the Dead Sea even reported in sick.
Ever so slightly more seriously, I remember it going on stream here. Given that we lived on a farm out in the boonies without gas anyway, it didn't have much impact on my life at the time. I've since been involved with some fairly large gas compressor drives, upwards of 6,000kW, Compressing enough gas that it affects the GDP if they go wrong, Yes, very serious stuff. They say jump. We jump.
Where does that gas come from? The North Sea and tankered in from the middle east.
None of it, as far as I'm aware, is a product of fracking.
That is different than natural gas.
Both are fossil fuels.
Both pollute.
If you want to argue over posts, please be clear.
#56
Posted 19 November 2013 - 04:00 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 19 November 2013 - 03:49 AM, said:
Are you talking about gasoline?
That is different than natural gas.
Both are fossil fuels.
Both pollute.
If you want to argue over posts, please be clear.
That is different than natural gas.
Both are fossil fuels.
Both pollute.
If you want to argue over posts, please be clear.
I don't really don't see what isn't clear about that.
But you know, ignorant Brit strikes again..........
And just a little point of information for you. We don't call the liquid vehicle fuel gasoline here so that ought not to have been a point of confusion.
#57
Posted 19 November 2013 - 06:21 AM
I would like to get this thread back on track, the water used in fossil fuels can be discussed in other areas. My concern is for our planets most threatened natural resource FRESH WATER.
Can we please be responsible enough to the readers of this forum to give them everyday practical solutions.. Things like repairing a dripping faucet that can waste water, or washing dishes in a sink instead of a dishwasher, or installing drip irrigation in your garden or yard.
WATER, WATER, WATER that is what this thread is about.
Can we please be responsible enough to the readers of this forum to give them everyday practical solutions.. Things like repairing a dripping faucet that can waste water, or washing dishes in a sink instead of a dishwasher, or installing drip irrigation in your garden or yard.
WATER, WATER, WATER that is what this thread is about.
#58
Posted 19 November 2013 - 06:31 AM
E3 wise, on 19 November 2013 - 06:21 AM, said:
I would like to get this thread back on track, the water used in fossil fuels can be discussed in other areas. My concern is for our planets most threatened natural resource FRESH WATER.
Can we please be responsible enough to the readers of this forum to give them everyday practical solutions.. Things like repairing a dripping faucet that can waste water, or washing dishes in a sink instead of a dishwasher, or installing drip irrigation in your garden or yard.
WATER, WATER, WATER that is what this thread is about.
Can we please be responsible enough to the readers of this forum to give them everyday practical solutions.. Things like repairing a dripping faucet that can waste water, or washing dishes in a sink instead of a dishwasher, or installing drip irrigation in your garden or yard.
WATER, WATER, WATER that is what this thread is about.
Been here before on the dishwasher issue.
A related article:
http://www.treehugge...is-greener.html
#59
Posted 20 November 2013 - 04:33 AM
(And Thanks E3 for getting us back on track here-my bad.) 
Apartment, condo, town-home owners should be fined, imo for letting their sprinkler heads go un-repaired.
I don't know how many times I've seen water shooting straight up into the air because a head was
broken.
And of course, it just runs off into the gutter.
Habits are hard to break too, so if people are used to letting the water run while doing the dishes, or shaving,
it takes a re-think to get them to change.
I think municipalities could go a long way in changing that if they restricted water usage; especially in the
Southwest were it is becoming scarce.
Our new slogan-
Give a rip, don't let it drip.
Apartment, condo, town-home owners should be fined, imo for letting their sprinkler heads go un-repaired.
I don't know how many times I've seen water shooting straight up into the air because a head was
broken.
And of course, it just runs off into the gutter.
Habits are hard to break too, so if people are used to letting the water run while doing the dishes, or shaving,
it takes a re-think to get them to change.
I think municipalities could go a long way in changing that if they restricted water usage; especially in the
Southwest were it is becoming scarce.
Our new slogan-
Give a rip, don't let it drip.
#60
Posted 20 November 2013 - 05:10 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 20 November 2013 - 04:33 AM, said:
Apartment, condo, town-home owners should be fined, imo for letting their sprinkler heads go un-repaired.
I don't know how many times I've seen water shooting straight up into the air because a head was
broken.
And of course, it just runs off into the gutter.
I don't know how many times I've seen water shooting straight up into the air because a head was
broken.
And of course, it just runs off into the gutter.
If the sprinklers for for irrigating grass, wouldn't Astroturf be an option and do away with the sprinkler system altogether? And save water that way.
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