"Greenpeace released its latest report today asking, "How clean is your cloud?"
The annual report examines the server farms built by the largest Internet companies —
including Amazon, Apple, Facebook, Google, Microsoft and Yahoo —
and ranks them according to how efficient their cloud facilities are, and where they get
their electricity.
Many server farms can consume as much electricity as a small city.
Yahoo was the only major Internet company in the study to get most of its electricity from
renewable or clean energy sources, according to the report.
Google and Yahoo historically have led the pack in trying to move more cloud computing toward renewable sources of energy.
Amazon, Apple and Microsoft continue to rapidly add server capacity, but according to Greenpeace, don't seem to care where their electricity comes from.
All three rely heavily on coal, which Greenpeace calls a dirty and polluting source of power.
Apple, Amazon and Microsoft are building data centers powered by coal.
Amazon refused to discuss any details about energy consumption at its data centers, but called
the report "inaccurate."
http://www.npr.org/b...oud?ft=1&f=1025
As consumers, we should demand that these companies utilize renewables. Millions of
people worldwide use computers.
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Computer users and dirty "clouds."
Started by Shortpoet-GTD, Apr 19 2012 03:22 AM
20 replies to this topic
#2
Posted 19 April 2012 - 02:01 PM
So using the Cloud is not very good for the environment! I have not used it yet, but was considering it since I just lost all the data on my computer because it crashed. The consumpation of energy to support the many users of the Cloud has not been put out to the many users of the Cloud just how much it can help you get to your documents when you need them no matter where you are.
There are two sides to every story and most computer users don't think about the energy they use.
There are two sides to every story and most computer users don't think about the energy they use.
#3
Posted 19 April 2012 - 03:06 PM
Pat, on 19 April 2012 - 02:01 PM, said:
So using the Cloud is not very good for the environment! I have not used it yet, but was considering it since I just lost all the data on my computer because it crashed. The consumpation of energy to support the many users of the Cloud has not been put out to the many users of the Cloud just how much it can help you get to your documents when you need them no matter where you are.
There are two sides to every story and most computer users don't think about the energy they use.
There are two sides to every story and most computer users don't think about the energy they use.
many services local or on the web that provide that for a small monthly fee-regardless of using the "cloud."
#4
Posted 25 April 2012 - 12:37 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 19 April 2012 - 03:22 AM, said:
Amazon, Apple and Microsoft continue to rapidly add server capacity, but according to Greenpeace, don't seem to care where their electricity comes from.
All three rely heavily on coal, which Greenpeace calls a dirty and polluting source of power.
Apple, Amazon and Microsoft are building data centers powered by coal.
Amazon refused to discuss any details about energy consumption at its data centers, but called
the report "inaccurate."
All three rely heavily on coal, which Greenpeace calls a dirty and polluting source of power.
Apple, Amazon and Microsoft are building data centers powered by coal.
Amazon refused to discuss any details about energy consumption at its data centers, but called
the report "inaccurate."
I have always been sure that Apple and Microsoft don't care about environment but money they earn.
However I can't believe how Amazon handles this information trying to mislead people. I tried to get some file on Amazon cloud but I smell something fishy reading through its many and confusing documents so I ended up abandoning the idea of the cloud for the future when I can clear this up a bit more.
Even though this reading confirms what I suspected about Amazon, shame on them.
#5
Posted 25 April 2012 - 09:40 AM
Now I am guilty. I have tons of data backed up on an external HDD however, all of them as well are stored in the "cloud" through (really sorry) Yahoo. Now Im thinking.. thanks for this, I will surely delete everything and move those that needs to be on better servers like Google.
#7
Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:51 AM
This is good information to know and I bet most people sadly, do not. Time to spread the word! I have never used a cloud to store data. I really don't have all that much and have been able to store files on thumb drives quite well so far. I am glad now that I have been able to do this.
It is quite amazing to me that some of these farms consume as much as 180,000 homes!
It is odd how these big corporations are not even making an effort to use renewable energy, but if you go to their websites they all have the color green on them somewhere.
It is quite amazing to me that some of these farms consume as much as 180,000 homes!
It is odd how these big corporations are not even making an effort to use renewable energy, but if you go to their websites they all have the color green on them somewhere.
#8
Posted 15 May 2012 - 01:49 PM
dissn_it, on 15 May 2012 - 10:51 AM, said:
It is odd how these big corporations are not even making an effort to use renewable energy, but if you go to their websites they all have the color green on them somewhere.
#9
Posted 15 May 2012 - 07:51 PM
I have never used a cloud before and really didn't know anything about it until seeing a recent conversation on Howard Clark. I really don't need to use it tho. I do blog, but I don't have important files on my computer to store,
#10
Posted 31 May 2012 - 06:41 AM
I don't think its the data centers themselves that are run on coal. Do they buy coal and shovel it into ovens? Or is it just the local power suppliers that use coal. Coal is very cheap right now, and until renewable energy becomes cheaper it won't take over as the preferred power source. Although these large companies could install their own devices like solar panels or maybe even wind turbines, but again it comes down to cost savings.
#12
Posted 31 May 2012 - 12:24 PM
iebo, on 31 May 2012 - 06:41 AM, said:
I don't think its the data centers themselves that are run on coal. Do they buy coal and shovel it into ovens?
If the electric utility that supplies their data centers is run on coal, and they plug their equipment into the wall
from that source, OF COURSE they're using coal.
#13
Posted 01 June 2012 - 06:51 PM
The only type of cloud that I use is the one which stores my Nook books on. I know this is not saying much for me, but I prefer using my computer and external hard drive. Then I know how much power it is consuming, which is not much at night because they are all unplugged and when not in use during the day.
#15
Posted 07 June 2012 - 10:57 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 31 May 2012 - 12:24 PM, said:
What?
If the electric utility that supplies their data centers is run on coal, and they plug their equipment into the wall
from that source, OF COURSE they're using coal.
If the electric utility that supplies their data centers is run on coal, and they plug their equipment into the wall
from that source, OF COURSE they're using coal.
By that our argument you and I are also using coal.
The companies that run data centers cannot choose what local power suppliers use for energy, especially since the companies will change what they use based on what is cheapest at the moment. Again, it comes down the renewables becoming the cheapest option for the electricity producers.
#16
Posted 07 June 2012 - 12:16 PM
iebo, on 07 June 2012 - 10:57 AM, said:
By that our argument you and I are also using coal.
The companies that run data centers cannot choose what local power suppliers use for energy, especially since the companies will change what they use based on what is cheapest at the moment. Again, it comes down the renewables becoming the cheapest option for the electricity producers.
The companies that run data centers cannot choose what local power suppliers use for energy, especially since the companies will change what they use based on what is cheapest at the moment. Again, it comes down the renewables becoming the cheapest option for the electricity producers.
Coal supplies a large percentage of our electric.
And to your argument of "data centers cannot choose what local power suppliers use for energy" is
totally bogus, imo.
With the amount of money that microsoft has, they can easily use their own solar or erect wind turbines
for their own use. They don't "have to choose" coal.
Or they can swing their wallets around to those utilities and say "hey-go green or we won't use you."
With that kind of power and money, the utilities would listen.
Point being-Google and a few others are using renewables to a higher degree; why can't apple, amazon
& microsoft do the same?
In the meantime, why support their emissions via clouds?
#17
Posted 08 June 2012 - 04:51 PM
I am kind of torn by this posting, I follow GreenPeace and am a supporter, but I also understand that Apple has been adding alternative energy to its server centers. The center being built in North Carolina is to powered by solar and hydrogen from biomass. I also have read recently that Apple has been increasing its use of alternative energy for its California center.
I read at http://www.hydrogenf...mputing/853201/ that the two are arguing about the accuracy of the article. Personally I think that anything that makes tech companies move toward alt energy is a good thing.
On the question of cloud computing I must admit I have never used it, mostly because I back up things here at the office and since my email was hacked recently, I have become even more paranoid about where I store my information. I am glad that electricity from coal is dropping but saddened that electricity from natural gas fracking is on the rise.
That why I like this posting because it makes us all examine where we get our electricity, here in South Florida we get ours from nuclear, so personally I think this is the worst, even though we have solar here at the house I still have to use FPL electricity during the summer for the Air Conditioning, so its not a perfect solution.
Nice posting ShortPoet.
I read at http://www.hydrogenf...mputing/853201/ that the two are arguing about the accuracy of the article. Personally I think that anything that makes tech companies move toward alt energy is a good thing.
On the question of cloud computing I must admit I have never used it, mostly because I back up things here at the office and since my email was hacked recently, I have become even more paranoid about where I store my information. I am glad that electricity from coal is dropping but saddened that electricity from natural gas fracking is on the rise.
That why I like this posting because it makes us all examine where we get our electricity, here in South Florida we get ours from nuclear, so personally I think this is the worst, even though we have solar here at the house I still have to use FPL electricity during the summer for the Air Conditioning, so its not a perfect solution.
Nice posting ShortPoet.
#19
Posted 09 June 2012 - 04:17 AM
This is crazy. I already knew Google's always trying to leap to greener ideas to further their business structure. I had no idea Yahoo! would be the leader though. As for the other companies, I thought Apple out of all of them would be looking into this quite frequently. I guess I'm wrong for assuming. Shame.
#20
Posted 12 June 2012 - 06:22 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 07 June 2012 - 12:16 PM, said:
Of course we're using coal.
Coal supplies a large percentage of our electric.
And to your argument of "data centers cannot choose what local power suppliers use for energy" is
totally bogus, imo.
With the amount of money that microsoft has, they can easily use their own solar or erect wind turbines
for their own use. They don't "have to choose" coal.
Or they can swing their wallets around to those utilities and say "hey-go green or we won't use you."
With that kind of power and money, the utilities would listen.
Point being-Google and a few others are using renewables to a higher degree; why can't apple, amazon
& microsoft do the same?
In the meantime, why support their emissions via clouds?
Coal supplies a large percentage of our electric.
And to your argument of "data centers cannot choose what local power suppliers use for energy" is
totally bogus, imo.
With the amount of money that microsoft has, they can easily use their own solar or erect wind turbines
for their own use. They don't "have to choose" coal.
Or they can swing their wallets around to those utilities and say "hey-go green or we won't use you."
With that kind of power and money, the utilities would listen.
Point being-Google and a few others are using renewables to a higher degree; why can't apple, amazon
& microsoft do the same?
In the meantime, why support their emissions via clouds?
Yeah they can use their own solar or wind but I'm sure they've considered this and decided it was cheaper to just use their local supplier. And as far as swinging their big fat wallets, they don't have as much influence as the hundreds of thousands of smaller customers (you and I) who won't leave them if they don't change their power generation methods. Most electric companies have a monopoly in their local area, there really isn't much you can do unless you go off-grid.
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